Jam vs. Jelly
Jam<>Jelly? The two sides weigh in.
(These two weren’t actually in a chat window with each other, I was just passing along messages between them.)
Me: Jillian says 'jam = boo, jelly = ooh'
Kevin: she’s a plebe
only plebes hate the real bits of fruit
or she can't spread well
which im not even gonna go into"
Jillian: If I wanted real bits of fruit, I'd eat some fruit
Like chunky peanut butter--why not just eat peanuts?
Jam is like failed jelly--they just got lazy while mashing
Kevin: jam cannot be touched by jelly
it’s a formless goop ball which was inspired by science fiction writer hendrence d. trails after seeing the movie the blob
and it has no texture, no seeds, it's fruit which had its soul sucked out by machines
Jillian: If jelly is fruit with a machine-sucked soul, what is jam? Fruit blessed with a jelly dressing
Seems like he's too good for jelly, but jam is not
Kevin: jam is the handmade beauty and hard labor + patience that only humans can produce. or do you want to lay down to the cyborg armies right now!?
Jillian: As if machines don't make things better? Yeah, I don't need that pace-maker, I want good 'ol fashioned man-power beating life back into my chest.
While I'm lying here dying, I'll have one last bite of jam, since I no longer fear choking on the bits of fruit.
Kevin: also jelly has added sugar and thats for dweebos
jelly comes in peanut butter and jelly in the same jar
what kind of atrocity is that
also jelly comes in a squeeze bottle
i feel like if i need to put anything else after that i already won.
Jillian: So ketchup, mustard, honey, personal lubricant, shampoo, body wash, vanilla-scented hand sanitizer...and so forth...are all worthless and not defendable?
Additionally, jelly comes in both squeeze bottle and jar form, for added variety
jam cannot be convenient and variable because of its chunky fruit shackles
Kevin: you can get all those things in non squeeze bottle form
and comparing lube and shampoo with things you put on toast
i think makes my case
jam is winnar
Jillian: Because they are all a part of our everyday, comfortable lives? Jam just hasn't caught up to the 21st century
Kevin: added sugar was still not addressed
jam would never lower itself to the plastic disposable world we've lowered our standards to dwell in. and my hand sanitizer and shampoo comes with pump tops. if you want to pump jelly onto your toast. thats your decision
i can't stop you but i DID warn you
Jillian: To condemn anything based on its added sugar content is absurd, especially considering you can get jelly sugar-free just as easily. Also, jam, too, has added sugar
So that argument is moot, it's like saying "jelly tastes like fruit"
Kevin: fruit HAS sugar
to add in refined sugar is defiling the fruit
Jillian: Okay, so jam defiles the fruit, too.
Kevin: saying that added refined cane sugar or corn syrup to a fruits natural glucose does not = jally tastes like fruit
Jillian: Jelly and jam = both have added sugar
You're arguing against jelly with a point that degrades jam as well
So now you're arguing against both jelly AND jam
Kevin: of course they do make shitty sugar jam but thats just as bad as jelly. TRUE jam stands above all
Jillian: Who is "they"? The different between jelly and jam = fruit bits.
That's it.
http://recipes.howstuffworks.com/question84.htm
Kevin: the richness of flavour that you get in a realy good jam could never be matched by jelly
its not just textural
jelly pretty much refers to low grade fruit spreads, its not just about bits of fruit
At a certain point in the quality scale as you climb it jelly stops showing up as a term because once it gets really good they will call it preserves or spread
jelly is a more loaded and specific term than i think was being acknowledged
Jillian: They do not change the name based on 'quality of texture or taste.' The definitions are pretty straightforward, and you're altering them based on personal, not objective, opinion.
The "loaded" term is merely the load of opinion you're spewing out
Kevin: there is a driving misunderstanding of this entire argument
b/c every argument is based of off misunderstandings ultimately
jillians terms : jam and jelly are the same only difference is fruit bits . my terms : jelly holds a specific place in the fruit spread tier and refers to lower quality spreads without fruit bits
a non fruit bit spread from like a boutique store won't be called jelly pretty much ever whereas smuckers or something will always say that
Jillian: Yes, it's an elitist definition, it's like a fancy chocolate store having a "truffle" but Hershey's just calling it a chocolate ball or something
It creates a certain impression, but not because of definitive quality
Kevin: exactly
truffle vs. chocolate ball
now we are talking
Kevin: only one last point
about the glass ceiling for quality
being generally capped for products that use certain terms
where as it is not as capped with other terms
this doesn't neccesitate any definite increase in quality
but the possibility is more open
hence my preference for the elitist term and the possibility of crazy flavor
Kevin: i want her closing statement, we resolved the conflict of terms. that's the best philosophical outcome. we are not fruit spread fascists trying to force or influence preference! merely seeing the field for all its positions clearly.
Jillian: I can't offer a closing statement, because his terminology is inaccurate, and I have no statement on it. If we were arguing over which is prettier, the sky or the grass, and I said, "well, for me, green is the prettiest color, and the sky is green, thus the sky is prettiest, what do you say?" How could he respond?
Kevin: i guess she is just rejecting my definition and doesn't want to respond on those terms. and yet it can't be argued that my definition doesn't exist societally b/c of the chocolate example.
If she wants to parse it out so that the only difference between jam and jelly is bits of fruit then i recognize that definition although I personally find it oversimplified and creates a problem in that there is now no way to differentiate quality from the terms. although that seemed to be her intention anyway to make quality of spread a different category entirely. from that definition its only a matter of preference for bits.
(These two weren’t actually in a chat window with each other, I was just passing along messages between them.)
Me: Jillian says 'jam = boo, jelly = ooh'
Kevin: she’s a plebe
only plebes hate the real bits of fruit
or she can't spread well
which im not even gonna go into"
Jillian: If I wanted real bits of fruit, I'd eat some fruit
Like chunky peanut butter--why not just eat peanuts?
Jam is like failed jelly--they just got lazy while mashing
Kevin: jam cannot be touched by jelly
it’s a formless goop ball which was inspired by science fiction writer hendrence d. trails after seeing the movie the blob
and it has no texture, no seeds, it's fruit which had its soul sucked out by machines
Jillian: If jelly is fruit with a machine-sucked soul, what is jam? Fruit blessed with a jelly dressing
Seems like he's too good for jelly, but jam is not
Kevin: jam is the handmade beauty and hard labor + patience that only humans can produce. or do you want to lay down to the cyborg armies right now!?
Jillian: As if machines don't make things better? Yeah, I don't need that pace-maker, I want good 'ol fashioned man-power beating life back into my chest.
While I'm lying here dying, I'll have one last bite of jam, since I no longer fear choking on the bits of fruit.
Kevin: also jelly has added sugar and thats for dweebos
jelly comes in peanut butter and jelly in the same jar
what kind of atrocity is that
also jelly comes in a squeeze bottle
i feel like if i need to put anything else after that i already won.
Jillian: So ketchup, mustard, honey, personal lubricant, shampoo, body wash, vanilla-scented hand sanitizer...and so forth...are all worthless and not defendable?
Additionally, jelly comes in both squeeze bottle and jar form, for added variety
jam cannot be convenient and variable because of its chunky fruit shackles
Kevin: you can get all those things in non squeeze bottle form
and comparing lube and shampoo with things you put on toast
i think makes my case
jam is winnar
Jillian: Because they are all a part of our everyday, comfortable lives? Jam just hasn't caught up to the 21st century
Kevin: added sugar was still not addressed
jam would never lower itself to the plastic disposable world we've lowered our standards to dwell in. and my hand sanitizer and shampoo comes with pump tops. if you want to pump jelly onto your toast. thats your decision
i can't stop you but i DID warn you
Jillian: To condemn anything based on its added sugar content is absurd, especially considering you can get jelly sugar-free just as easily. Also, jam, too, has added sugar
So that argument is moot, it's like saying "jelly tastes like fruit"
Kevin: fruit HAS sugar
to add in refined sugar is defiling the fruit
Jillian: Okay, so jam defiles the fruit, too.
Kevin: saying that added refined cane sugar or corn syrup to a fruits natural glucose does not = jally tastes like fruit
Jillian: Jelly and jam = both have added sugar
You're arguing against jelly with a point that degrades jam as well
So now you're arguing against both jelly AND jam
Kevin: of course they do make shitty sugar jam but thats just as bad as jelly. TRUE jam stands above all
Jillian: Who is "they"? The different between jelly and jam = fruit bits.
That's it.
http://recipes.howstuffworks.com/question84.htm
Kevin: the richness of flavour that you get in a realy good jam could never be matched by jelly
its not just textural
jelly pretty much refers to low grade fruit spreads, its not just about bits of fruit
At a certain point in the quality scale as you climb it jelly stops showing up as a term because once it gets really good they will call it preserves or spread
jelly is a more loaded and specific term than i think was being acknowledged
Jillian: They do not change the name based on 'quality of texture or taste.' The definitions are pretty straightforward, and you're altering them based on personal, not objective, opinion.
The "loaded" term is merely the load of opinion you're spewing out
Kevin: there is a driving misunderstanding of this entire argument
b/c every argument is based of off misunderstandings ultimately
jillians terms : jam and jelly are the same only difference is fruit bits . my terms : jelly holds a specific place in the fruit spread tier and refers to lower quality spreads without fruit bits
a non fruit bit spread from like a boutique store won't be called jelly pretty much ever whereas smuckers or something will always say that
Jillian: Yes, it's an elitist definition, it's like a fancy chocolate store having a "truffle" but Hershey's just calling it a chocolate ball or something
It creates a certain impression, but not because of definitive quality
Kevin: exactly
truffle vs. chocolate ball
now we are talking
Kevin: only one last point
about the glass ceiling for quality
being generally capped for products that use certain terms
where as it is not as capped with other terms
this doesn't neccesitate any definite increase in quality
but the possibility is more open
hence my preference for the elitist term and the possibility of crazy flavor
Kevin: i want her closing statement, we resolved the conflict of terms. that's the best philosophical outcome. we are not fruit spread fascists trying to force or influence preference! merely seeing the field for all its positions clearly.
Jillian: I can't offer a closing statement, because his terminology is inaccurate, and I have no statement on it. If we were arguing over which is prettier, the sky or the grass, and I said, "well, for me, green is the prettiest color, and the sky is green, thus the sky is prettiest, what do you say?" How could he respond?
Kevin: i guess she is just rejecting my definition and doesn't want to respond on those terms. and yet it can't be argued that my definition doesn't exist societally b/c of the chocolate example.
If she wants to parse it out so that the only difference between jam and jelly is bits of fruit then i recognize that definition although I personally find it oversimplified and creates a problem in that there is now no way to differentiate quality from the terms. although that seemed to be her intention anyway to make quality of spread a different category entirely. from that definition its only a matter of preference for bits.
posted by Joey | 1:37 PM
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